Actually, that's some of both the Author and OP King's prime reasoning behind what they do.
Look where the Author is now.
One person can't do it alone, it'd take almost the entire multiverse conspiring against the Narrative and Conflict to dethrone either, because in the face of such a threat, they'd work together. Dethrone one without the support of the other?
Well, that means you could do it to both.
And neither force wants to give up it's hold over reality.
He knows that, realistically, doing it on his own is basically impossible. Why do you think he made that agreement with Alicia? And she's not the first one, either. If it takes an army to dethrone the Conflict, Verdana will go out and start recruiting, because hey, revenge is revenge, no matter who in the end actually gets the job done.
So when he inevitably arrives here, don't be too surprised if he tries to rope others into his plan.
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Here's my thoughts on destroying the Conflict. You can most definitely weaken one force to the point of near-nothing influence, but the Narrative and the Conflict can NEVER be destroyed. I mean it in this case. Without conflict, there are no stories, and without stories, there can be no Narrative. Similarly, without stories to contain it, there can be no conflict, and without conflict, there can be no Conflict. Destroying one absolutely and totally equates to destroying both absolutely and totally, and seeing as the entirety of Fiction is literally built on those two forces, I don't think destroying them is a very good idea unless you want to take omnicide to the extreme and right out to the other side of extreme. You would be destroying the entirety of Fiction if you destroyed them.
I suspect those who follow the PAS session already know that Verdana really wants to kill The Conflict.
Okay, let's go over a few things here.
1. The Conflict is one of the two strongest things in existence. You want to be able to kill the Conflict? You've got to be able to control PLOT at its most basic, pure, and underlying form. I'm not talking about being a First Guardian or having an Update Terminal or having any of that crap. You need to be able to literally ERASE plot. I mean, plain and simple REMOVING it from existence. Nothing has EVER destroyed the Conflict. The only thing that came close was the Narrative, and it only had enough power to shatter it into many many pieces. Even then, the Conflict still worked just fine, just at a smaller scale.
2. Destroying the Conflict isn't as good as it sounds. Let's remember something here. Right now, or at least, right before the End of Act 4, the Narrative and Conflict are in BALANCE. I'm not saying balance means an equal amount of good and bad endings. I mean balance as in there are mainly good endings and a small amount of bad endings, because that's typically how stories go. But let's think about something here. Destroying one of the two forces of plot, if you were able to do so (WHICH YOU CAN'T), would irreversibly change Fiction. No matter what force of plot you removed, there would be a glaring IMBALANCE. Let's go over how removing the Narrative or the Conflict (or both) will turn out.
3. If the Narrative is destroyed, all of existence is. I'm not just talking about Fiction. I'm talking about Nonfiction, too. If the Conflict wins and it destroys the Narrative, it will become the sole power of all of reality. Every universe ever created, every parallel dimension, every alternate timeline, every corner of the Void, EVERYTHING, will be OBLITERATED. In an instant. And not only that. When the Conflict is done with Fiction, it's going to consume all of Nonfiction too. There will be literally NOTHING left. No story to be told, ever.
4. If the Conflict is destroyed, all of Fiction is, just at a relatively slower rate. I know how this would be hard to believe, but hear me out. If you destroy one of the forces of plot, even if it's the bad one, there will still be a very big vacuum. Since the Conflict is gone, all sources of evil in every conceivable point in Nonfiction will cease to exist. All drive to do anything wrong, all evil deeds everywhere and anywhere, will be erased. There will be no desire to do anything wrong at all. The only thing that will exist is the law of the Narrative. The only thing that will exist is good.
Sounds like a good ending, right? Wrong. What's the point of adding to Fiction if life is so boring and monotonous? What's the point of making stories if all of them are going to go the exact same way? I'm not just talking about good always winning over evil. If the Conflict is killed, THERE WILL BE NO EVIL. There will be no reason to make a story. As bad as the Conflict is, conflict is one of the main reasons a story exists. What's the point otherwise? If you kill the Conflict, you are condemning Fiction to a death of atrophy. No new stories are made, no progress is made, so Fiction just fades away. Piece by piece. Painfully. And then, there's nothing.
5. If both forces of plot are destroyed, Fiction's spacetime collapses. This is what's going to inevitably happen if the Conflict is destroyed, or if SOMEHOW, both the Narrative and the Conflict are taken out at once. Since there is literally no plot whatsoever, there is nothing to dictate what happens at all. There are no laws, no constants, and no rules. This is a good thing, right? Anything can happen! Wrong. If there is nothing to guide existence, it falls apart. Spacetime collapses. There was no plot, there is no plot, and there never will be any plot. All stories ever made in the past, present, and future, cease to exist. Nonfiction still happens (assuming the Conflict doesn't die after taking over everything), but it's incredibly boring.
6. If you want to destroy the Conflict, you'd need to do it in a canon session. I mean, we've established firmly that you can't kill the Conflict in point 1, but destroying it in a noncanon spinoff like Pain & Suffering would mean absolutely nothing. (No offense to Pain & Suffering, but it's true.) You'd need to do it in a game that actually matters in the canon timeline. Of course, destroying the Conflict in the canon timeline would doom all noncanon timelines and parallel dimensions as well, so you're signing every DTG game's death warrant by doing so.
7. THE OP SCALE. THE OP SCALE, THE OP SCALE, THE OP SCALE, THE OP SCALE. I don't care how powerful you think you are. You think you can kill the Conflict anyway? THE OP SCALE. You have something that can bypass The OP Scale, which nothing has EVER done besides an Eleventh Hour Superpower that happened at the VERY end of the game and was only made by a literal deus ex machina who has been STATED to be UNABLE to touch the Conflict? TOO BAD, because all of the evidence I just said points to one irrefutable fact:
Twinbuilder, there is one problem with that: Tazz has said that there is an entity known as The Black that is powerful enough to destroy both entities outright. And even worse, all some genocidal maniac has to do is create a ton of Paradoxes and the entity shows up out of nowhere and destroys the game. So unless Tazz makes paradoxes themselves break the OP scale, someone can just create paradoxes until The Black destroys the universes.
On killing the Conflict, I'll say this: At this point, while there is one being, and I mean EXACTLY one being, which is stronger than the Narrative or the Conflict (both at once is shaky territory) and can erase one from existence permanently, it will never do so. I am referring to the Black Monolith, which, considering it will grant almost any OTHER wish without any issue, being basically a completely neutral automaton, BUT it is explicitly...Let's say 'programmed' for lack of a better term...It's explicitly programmed to NOT do that. Why?
Simply put, whist obliterating the Black Monolithis possible without any consequence whatsoever, the Conflict and the Narrative are SO huge, SO powerful and SO omnipresent, that should either go, their sudden lack of existence would doom existence itself. They've ingrained themselves almost into the atoms of existence (and that's ignoring the countless Agents), to the point where killing either would go hand-in-hand with killing existence. The only way around that is to somehow generate enough power to create an entity JUST as strong as the Narrative/Conflict to take its place...And it would have to be a VERY specific entity, to the point where you'd basically be remaking the Conflict/Narrative, just slightly differently. they've created a world (or shaped it) wherein they are functionally indispensable for the life of absolutely everything and anything in existence. And that assumes you can even deliver a blow that kills it: What if blowing it up just makes more agents, which still serve the same purpose and now are directly conscious, directly antagonistic forces that will actually directly kill you, or just empower the local first Guardians? The Narrative blowing up the Conflict into shards is as close as it got to crippling it without blowing up existence with it. For that matter, you incorrectly assume that there's a 'core' to either; at this point, they've basically occupied all corners of existence, permeating every atom, and you clearly can't even see the thing now, can you?
This isn't restricted to those two, either: I will say that certain OTHER beings are so ingrained in the functions of Fiction's works that, despite being echelons lower than the Conflict and the Narrative, killing them would destabilize existence to an EXTREME point, possibly even killing existence should it get that bad. In fact, I'll say that the easiest way to kill either is to end existence, which, naturally, would be complicated to deal with.
I'm not saying it's IMPOSSIBLE to kill the Conflict (or Narrative) without dooming everything, but...Functionally, you'd have to dedicate the whole game to it with a singular, massive combo charge carried by every player in the game using all their charge slots, which clearly isn't going to make for a very good game of DTG. And this would also include the Godmodder, who likely will be more interested in his own agenda.
Yeah. Good luck. Genuinely, you'll need it.
If you're wondering, the Black Monolith trumping the Conflict/Narrative in power but refusing to dethrone them because it would doom existence is something Twin said; I'm just mostly repeating the issue and explaining it in more detail. Bluh.
EDIT: Twin Ninja'd me massively but the point was made with his post. (Granted, I got the Black Monolith thing FROM twin, so either that's a misconception or Twin forgot about that.) Also, Crusher, the 1 roll on a Paradox is the CANONIZATION of the Black (well, that and his immediate release); Until then, he literally doesn't exist, period, and IF this happens, it will be retroactive. I'd go deeper but that's really all that needs to be said on him. Finally, on Talist, I generally have Narrative as the force of Protagonism and Conflict as the force of Antagonism for precisely the reasons you just said The Conflict does not want to obliterate reality because it actually WANTS to, it wants to do so because, in doing so, it shall become an antagonist and shall thereby generate Protagonists to attempt to defeat him, and during this time it shall toy with the forces of the protagonists and attempt to mock and crush them because it is the Antagonist's thing to do. The Narrative is GENERALLY good and the Conflict is GENERALLY bad for this reason, mind, as most stories in fiction are on some level good versus evil.
In other news: Piono, I'll hear it out, but it's gonna have to be AMAZING to uncancel DTG3, doubly so since DTG0 is nowhere near done (though I am speeding it up). And by 'amazing' I mean 'quite frankly this ought to be the basis for a legitimate franchise after this is all over.' At this point, the primary issue is because we're kind of suspecting everyone'll grow tired of DTG games after 0 (barring waiting a LONG time, which really would mean most of us would be long gone when you kickstarted it). And 0 is looking to become longer than I had anticipated, primarily given I can't seem to update on time for the life of me (#selfdeprecation).
But yeah, you still need conflict in any half decent story. Nobody wants to hear about how Luke Skywalker peacefully lived out his completely normal life on a farm.
And also evil is very hard to objectively define. Morals depend on the time and culture, so showing Star Wars to modern audiences, people cheer for the rebels. But if we somehow showed it to people of ancient Imperial Rome (and got over the whole moving picture thing), they might cheer for the empire and believe that a strong central authority is the best way to keep order.
We like to think we're enlightened, but in 200 or 300 years, we'll probably have some completely new code of morals and wonder how we ever thought X was considered socially acceptable in the backwards 21st century.
Sorry, got kinda carried away with my point...
Edit- And we shouldn't have to play every game to defend parts of our RP. I've tried to play the Terraria version a few times... but for whatever reason I just don't find it very enjoyable.
Looks like it's time for one of those alternate realities, like that one which Phantom Walker came from, then. (For reference, he basically came from a world where the ABSOLUTE WORST POSSIBLE FATE occurred for every single character involved, precisely fine-tuned to each individual character.)
I'll use Walker as an example because I'm an egotistical insertswearwordhere.
As demonstrated before, with one of his attacks against Sans, he ultimately doesn't have a choice whether or not to fight. He can't show any mercy, even though deep down, he doesn't really want to keep fighting. BE!Walker is that situation ramped up to 11 and beyond - he briefly, for a time, died and was sent to heaven, finally able to do something other than kill... but then he was torn away, and is now undead, existing in constant pain and still forced to go through the same motions day after day after day of being tortured and having to kill, cutting down so many people that it's all just blended together and there's no point in caring about who they were, or in trying to rehabilitate him since his mind has cracked in a way that cannot be fixed. And, due to his visit to the mainverse world, he KNOWS that other variations of himself didn't go through the same utter hell that he went through, which basically adds insult to injury due to him being exclusively singled out, over all the other variations, for his living hell.
Similar vein - Joshua, that man with the blue clothing. Despite what it may seem, he's actually quite okay with his current life, aside from that bit where he was forced to kill his family due to circumstances. One of his strongest desires is to become immortal in some way. While his BE! counterpart hasn't appeared here yet, let's just say that, well... pumping oneself full of Death-element in the belief that one's body can become immune to it is a VERY stupid idea. It destroyed his mind and body to the point where he's had to have cybernetics forcibly installed into his head just to hold his existence together, which is utter agony on the still-functional parts of his body. The device he carries on his back, which grants him his powers, was similarly affected, degrading to the point where nobody can repair the damage, limiting him to only a fraction of what his full power used to be. Yes, he's technically immortal because he can't die in his current state, but the cost was far too high, he's barely even recognizable as himself anymore... et cetera et cetera.
Black Ending Engie is a subject that I really don't want to get into. Let's just leave it that his personality is inspired by someone's alternative character interpretation of him being a dangerous and psychopathic megalomaniac.
Sounds like a good ending, right? Wrong. What's the point of adding to
Fiction if life is so boring and monotonous? What's the point of making
stories if all of them are going to go the exact same way? I'm not just
talking about good always winning over evil. If the Conflict is killed,
THERE WILL BE NO EVIL. There will be no reason to make a story. As bad
as the Conflict is, conflict is one of the main reasons a story exists.
What's the point otherwise? If you kill the Conflict, you are condemning
Fiction to a death of atrophy. No new stories are made, no progress is
made, so Fiction just fades away. Piece by piece. Painfully. And then,
there's nothing.
That is false I have seen that I can write stories without evil conflict or people doing mistakes or bad stuff happening or anything of this kind.
Going from the principle any of those is needed is just being restrained.
Well, I easily know Star's Bad Ending/Black Ending: Immortal, laid up in an alternate dimension, seeing everything that is going wrong, but being unable to fix any of it. Basically, being an immortal observer without being able to interact.
Anyone else want to take a crack?
Revan already has their worst ending possible for them.
And Nyarly... Well, I doubt he can be given a bad ending... He's just too strong, he could be minorly inconvenienced for a 100 years or so...
You just have to be strong enough, and we've got characters capable of doing it.
As a side note on the rant about not being able to kill the Conflict, I mostly agree with Tazz and Twin, no disagreements important enough to deserve being mentioned, so yeah. No killing the Conflict. If such a thing happened, it would have to be in some sort of ultimate grand finale involving, I dunno, thousands of forum goers and like a hundred coordinated GMs.
Somehow, I don't see that happening any time soon.
Anyways tazz, yeah, it's sort of a 'distant thought' idea. My thought was to have it hosted on the DTG forums, since there's likely to be lots of non-canon (or potentially-canon. Call it schrodingers canon since most likely aspects from non-canon sessions will be brought in) sessions in the meantime to keep use occupied. Once the time comes for it, we'd start DTG3.
I dunno, it's a vague idea in my head right now, not one I want to implement for a while anyways.
You just have to be strong enough, and we've got characters capable of doing it.
Well, Nyarlathotep is different case than most eldritch beings...
One, you'd have to kill off all of the Outer Gods to take him down, he'd merely regenerate. This includes Yog-Sothoth, The physical embodiment of Space and Time (Yog was the collection of spheres, sidenote: those spheres were every universe ever) And Azathoth, the Center of all universes. (Azy was the weird clam thing before he became the Center, now Azy is a bit... incomprehensible)
If you don't take them out before hunting down Nyarly, he'll just regenerate due to being their physical embodiment of their souls and consciousnesses. So... You'd gorilla over everything universe ever to even have a chance of killing him.
Second, you'd have to fight all of Nyarly's Masks in the Nothingness due to reality collapsing. All 1000 of them.
Hopefully the Narrative and the Conflict could piece reality back together after you defeated him.
So you are right Piono, you can kill Nyarlathotep, but is it worth it?
So kids what have we learned today?
Murder isn't always the best solution?
Good job. But did we really need to teach you that? I mean for humans that should just be common sense.
Also to fill image quota here is an artist's inaccurate depictions of my dear... "fathers" Azathoth and Yog-Sothoth... Heh.... Humans giving us false names... Always enjoyable.
Fun fact, Lovecraftian horrors have a limited extent. Nyalathotep is unkillable without wrecking a certain GROUP of universes. Just like paradox space is its own universe cluster, the ones that the lovecraftian horrors originate from is its own cluster. It is possible to kill them.
It would wreck things on a scale greater than the first DTG (not the second one, that one was truly catastrophic), but it's still possible.
And I have the OP King, who, barring the OP scale, and also the fact that he doesn't exist right now, would be more than capable of wiping the entire thing off the face of reality. Permanently.
But if worst comes to worst, I also have Eternis, the god of infinity.
But this is a pointless fight.
Also, I decided, against my own better judgement, to, why not? join DTG0. I have way too much time on my hands anyways.
I'm going to go with a nondescript character, as this is just another thing of the OP King putting his two cents in because ego. I doubt I'll have a large effect, since I'm just going to be going with straight elementals, archons and titans.
EDiT:
O.O
That's a lot of stuff to take in all at once. I'm probably going to be useless for the first couple of rounds.
Ah but you forget something, how big the influence of the Cthulhu Mythos has gotten along with its characters popping up in multiple realities (Stephen King's Universe for starters, Nyarlathotep is the main anagonist of Dark Tower), but once again pointless and besides the OP King could probably curb-stomp Nyarly.
But why would they bother with me, besides... I'd love to meet their creator as well as their newest comrade instead.
Speaking of Hypothetical Fights, a certain matter never got resolved satisfyingly
The OP King's creator? That could be one of two people: either the Author, who is stronger, or Eric, who is one of my weakest characters, being at an actually reasonable power level.
The OP King's creator? That could be one of two people: either the Author, who is stronger, or Eric, who is one of my weakest characters, being at an actually reasonable power level.
Yes.
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He ate the bread that he made from stone
He fell from the Temple, never broke a bone
Bowed down to the Emperor and watched as former King was overthrown
The Meaning of Life, the Universe, and Everything.
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Take 19½ shots every time somebody argues with Twin or Tazz over something not going their way.
Take 51 shots every time someone fails to read something.
I have a feeling those two alone would be lethal.
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Posts may contain high amounts of stupid.
. And you know what the best part of all this is? You'll DO it. And then you'll lose to me again. And again. And again!!! Because you want a "happy ending." Because you "love your friends." Because you "never give up." Isn't that delicious? Your "determination." The power that let you get this far... It's gonna be your downfall!
"THIS IS EQUAL PARTS FUNNY AND SAD."
"STOP LAUGHING AND KILL THE BUNNY!"
"YOU'RE GETTING QUOTED ON THAT ONE, CALLING IT NOW. WHY ARE YOU LOSING IT OVER ONE ENEMY ANYWAY?"
"I DON'T KNOW! THERE'S A BLANK SCREEN WHENEVER I PERFORM A MEMORY SEARCH! NOTHING SHOWS UP!"
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As is everybody else, really.
Piono, Eric, Hank...
Actually, that's some of both the Author and OP King's prime reasoning behind what they do.
Look where the Author is now.
One person can't do it alone, it'd take almost the entire multiverse conspiring against the Narrative and Conflict to dethrone either, because in the face of such a threat, they'd work together. Dethrone one without the support of the other?
Well, that means you could do it to both.
And neither force wants to give up it's hold over reality.
DTG Co Labs
Nope, sorry guys, no Destroy the Godmodder relevant stuff here...
At least, not yet.
He knows that, realistically, doing it on his own is basically impossible. Why do you think he made that agreement with Alicia? And she's not the first one, either. If it takes an army to dethrone the Conflict, Verdana will go out and start recruiting, because hey, revenge is revenge, no matter who in the end actually gets the job done.
So when he inevitably arrives here, don't be too surprised if he tries to rope others into his plan.
GODDAMN IT
STUPID GENDERFLIP VIRUS
Here's my thoughts on destroying the Conflict. You can most definitely weaken one force to the point of near-nothing influence, but the Narrative and the Conflict can NEVER be destroyed. I mean it in this case. Without conflict, there are no stories, and without stories, there can be no Narrative. Similarly, without stories to contain it, there can be no conflict, and without conflict, there can be no Conflict. Destroying one absolutely and totally equates to destroying both absolutely and totally, and seeing as the entirety of Fiction is literally built on those two forces, I don't think destroying them is a very good idea unless you want to take omnicide to the extreme and right out to the other side of extreme. You would be destroying the entirety of Fiction if you destroyed them.
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Avatar by TwinBuilder.
Okay, let's go over a few things here.
1. The Conflict is one of the two strongest things in existence. You want to be able to kill the Conflict? You've got to be able to control PLOT at its most basic, pure, and underlying form. I'm not talking about being a First Guardian or having an Update Terminal or having any of that crap. You need to be able to literally ERASE plot. I mean, plain and simple REMOVING it from existence. Nothing has EVER destroyed the Conflict. The only thing that came close was the Narrative, and it only had enough power to shatter it into many many pieces. Even then, the Conflict still worked just fine, just at a smaller scale.
2. Destroying the Conflict isn't as good as it sounds. Let's remember something here. Right now, or at least, right before the End of Act 4, the Narrative and Conflict are in BALANCE. I'm not saying balance means an equal amount of good and bad endings. I mean balance as in there are mainly good endings and a small amount of bad endings, because that's typically how stories go. But let's think about something here. Destroying one of the two forces of plot, if you were able to do so (WHICH YOU CAN'T), would irreversibly change Fiction. No matter what force of plot you removed, there would be a glaring IMBALANCE. Let's go over how removing the Narrative or the Conflict (or both) will turn out.
3. If the Narrative is destroyed, all of existence is. I'm not just talking about Fiction. I'm talking about Nonfiction, too. If the Conflict wins and it destroys the Narrative, it will become the sole power of all of reality. Every universe ever created, every parallel dimension, every alternate timeline, every corner of the Void, EVERYTHING, will be OBLITERATED. In an instant. And not only that. When the Conflict is done with Fiction, it's going to consume all of Nonfiction too. There will be literally NOTHING left. No story to be told, ever.
4. If the Conflict is destroyed, all of Fiction is, just at a relatively slower rate. I know how this would be hard to believe, but hear me out. If you destroy one of the forces of plot, even if it's the bad one, there will still be a very big vacuum. Since the Conflict is gone, all sources of evil in every conceivable point in Nonfiction will cease to exist. All drive to do anything wrong, all evil deeds everywhere and anywhere, will be erased. There will be no desire to do anything wrong at all. The only thing that will exist is the law of the Narrative. The only thing that will exist is good.
Sounds like a good ending, right? Wrong. What's the point of adding to Fiction if life is so boring and monotonous? What's the point of making stories if all of them are going to go the exact same way? I'm not just talking about good always winning over evil. If the Conflict is killed, THERE WILL BE NO EVIL. There will be no reason to make a story. As bad as the Conflict is, conflict is one of the main reasons a story exists. What's the point otherwise? If you kill the Conflict, you are condemning Fiction to a death of atrophy. No new stories are made, no progress is made, so Fiction just fades away. Piece by piece. Painfully. And then, there's nothing.
5. If both forces of plot are destroyed, Fiction's spacetime collapses. This is what's going to inevitably happen if the Conflict is destroyed, or if SOMEHOW, both the Narrative and the Conflict are taken out at once. Since there is literally no plot whatsoever, there is nothing to dictate what happens at all. There are no laws, no constants, and no rules. This is a good thing, right? Anything can happen! Wrong. If there is nothing to guide existence, it falls apart. Spacetime collapses. There was no plot, there is no plot, and there never will be any plot. All stories ever made in the past, present, and future, cease to exist. Nonfiction still happens (assuming the Conflict doesn't die after taking over everything), but it's incredibly boring.
6. If you want to destroy the Conflict, you'd need to do it in a canon session. I mean, we've established firmly that you can't kill the Conflict in point 1, but destroying it in a noncanon spinoff like Pain & Suffering would mean absolutely nothing. (No offense to Pain & Suffering, but it's true.) You'd need to do it in a game that actually matters in the canon timeline. Of course, destroying the Conflict in the canon timeline would doom all noncanon timelines and parallel dimensions as well, so you're signing every DTG game's death warrant by doing so.
7. THE OP SCALE. THE OP SCALE, THE OP SCALE, THE OP SCALE, THE OP SCALE. I don't care how powerful you think you are. You think you can kill the Conflict anyway? THE OP SCALE. You have something that can bypass The OP Scale, which nothing has EVER done besides an Eleventh Hour Superpower that happened at the VERY end of the game and was only made by a literal deus ex machina who has been STATED to be UNABLE to touch the Conflict? TOO BAD, because all of the evidence I just said points to one irrefutable fact:
Twinbuilder, there is one problem with that: Tazz has said that there is an entity known as The Black that is powerful enough to destroy both entities outright. And even worse, all some genocidal maniac has to do is create a ton of Paradoxes and the entity shows up out of nowhere and destroys the game. So unless Tazz makes paradoxes themselves break the OP scale, someone can just create paradoxes until The Black destroys the universes.
On killing the Conflict, I'll say this: At this point, while there is one being, and I mean EXACTLY one being, which is stronger than the Narrative or the Conflict (both at once is shaky territory) and can erase one from existence permanently, it will never do so. I am referring to the Black Monolith, which, considering it will grant almost any OTHER wish without any issue, being basically a completely neutral automaton, BUT it is explicitly...Let's say 'programmed' for lack of a better term...It's explicitly programmed to NOT do that. Why?
Simply put, whist obliterating the Black Monolith is possible without any consequence whatsoever, the Conflict and the Narrative are SO huge, SO powerful and SO omnipresent, that should either go, their sudden lack of existence would doom existence itself. They've ingrained themselves almost into the atoms of existence (and that's ignoring the countless Agents), to the point where killing either would go hand-in-hand with killing existence. The only way around that is to somehow generate enough power to create an entity JUST as strong as the Narrative/Conflict to take its place...And it would have to be a VERY specific entity, to the point where you'd basically be remaking the Conflict/Narrative, just slightly differently. they've created a world (or shaped it) wherein they are functionally indispensable for the life of absolutely everything and anything in existence. And that assumes you can even deliver a blow that kills it: What if blowing it up just makes more agents, which still serve the same purpose and now are directly conscious, directly antagonistic forces that will actually directly kill you, or just empower the local first Guardians? The Narrative blowing up the Conflict into shards is as close as it got to crippling it without blowing up existence with it. For that matter, you incorrectly assume that there's a 'core' to either; at this point, they've basically occupied all corners of existence, permeating every atom, and you clearly can't even see the thing now, can you?
This isn't restricted to those two, either: I will say that certain OTHER beings are so ingrained in the functions of Fiction's works that, despite being echelons lower than the Conflict and the Narrative, killing them would destabilize existence to an EXTREME point, possibly even killing existence should it get that bad. In fact, I'll say that the easiest way to kill either is to end existence, which, naturally, would be complicated to deal with.
I'm not saying it's IMPOSSIBLE to kill the Conflict (or Narrative) without dooming everything, but...Functionally, you'd have to dedicate the whole game to it with a singular, massive combo charge carried by every player in the game using all their charge slots, which clearly isn't going to make for a very good game of DTG. And this would also include the Godmodder, who likely will be more interested in his own agenda.
Yeah. Good luck. Genuinely, you'll need it.
If you're wondering, the Black Monolith trumping the Conflict/Narrative in power but refusing to dethrone them because it would doom existence is something Twin said; I'm just mostly repeating the issue and explaining it in more detail. Bluh.
EDIT: Twin Ninja'd me massively but the point was made with his post. (Granted, I got the Black Monolith thing FROM twin, so either that's a misconception or Twin forgot about that.) Also, Crusher, the 1 roll on a Paradox is the CANONIZATION of the Black (well, that and his immediate release); Until then, he literally doesn't exist, period, and IF this happens, it will be retroactive. I'd go deeper but that's really all that needs to be said on him. Finally, on Talist, I generally have Narrative as the force of Protagonism and Conflict as the force of Antagonism for precisely the reasons you just said The Conflict does not want to obliterate reality because it actually WANTS to, it wants to do so because, in doing so, it shall become an antagonist and shall thereby generate Protagonists to attempt to defeat him, and during this time it shall toy with the forces of the protagonists and attempt to mock and crush them because it is the Antagonist's thing to do. The Narrative is GENERALLY good and the Conflict is GENERALLY bad for this reason, mind, as most stories in fiction are on some level good versus evil.
In other news: Piono, I'll hear it out, but it's gonna have to be AMAZING to uncancel DTG3, doubly so since DTG0 is nowhere near done (though I am speeding it up). And by 'amazing' I mean 'quite frankly this ought to be the basis for a legitimate franchise after this is all over.' At this point, the primary issue is because we're kind of suspecting everyone'll grow tired of DTG games after 0 (barring waiting a LONG time, which really would mean most of us would be long gone when you kickstarted it). And 0 is looking to become longer than I had anticipated, primarily given I can't seem to update on time for the life of me (#selfdeprecation).
Um... Just to be a nit picky jerk, conflict isn't the same thing as evil. You can have conflict when both sides when both sides are moral, but still in opposition. Conflict is just when two groups have (or just believe they have) mutually exclusive goals.
But yeah, you still need conflict in any half decent story. Nobody wants to hear about how Luke Skywalker peacefully lived out his completely normal life on a farm.
And also evil is very hard to objectively define. Morals depend on the time and culture, so showing Star Wars to modern audiences, people cheer for the rebels. But if we somehow showed it to people of ancient Imperial Rome (and got over the whole moving picture thing), they might cheer for the empire and believe that a strong central authority is the best way to keep order.
We like to think we're enlightened, but in 200 or 300 years, we'll probably have some completely new code of morals and wonder how we ever thought X was considered socially acceptable in the backwards 21st century.
Sorry, got kinda carried away with my point...
Edit- And we shouldn't have to play every game to defend parts of our RP. I've tried to play the Terraria version a few times... but for whatever reason I just don't find it very enjoyable.
There's a difference between a hero and a champion. A champion overcomes threats, but a hero overcomes fears.
My Best Map so farAll my maps, click here.
Then there's also a Youtube channel I'm somewhat involved in.
...Hmm.
Looks like it's time for one of those alternate realities, like that one which Phantom Walker came from, then. (For reference, he basically came from a world where the ABSOLUTE WORST POSSIBLE FATE occurred for every single character involved, precisely fine-tuned to each individual character.)
GODDAMN IT
STUPID GENDERFLIP VIRUS
I'll use Walker as an example
because I'm an egotistical insertswearwordhere.As demonstrated before, with one of his attacks against Sans, he ultimately doesn't have a choice whether or not to fight. He can't show any mercy, even though deep down, he doesn't really want to keep fighting. BE!Walker is that situation ramped up to 11 and beyond - he briefly, for a time, died and was sent to heaven, finally able to do something other than kill... but then he was torn away, and is now undead, existing in constant pain and still forced to go through the same motions day after day after day of being tortured and having to kill, cutting down so many people that it's all just blended together and there's no point in caring about who they were, or in trying to rehabilitate him since his mind has cracked in a way that cannot be fixed. And, due to his visit to the mainverse world, he KNOWS that other variations of himself didn't go through the same utter hell that he went through, which basically adds insult to injury due to him being exclusively singled out, over all the other variations, for his living hell.
Similar vein - Joshua, that man with the blue clothing. Despite what it may seem, he's actually quite okay with his current life, aside from that bit where he was forced to kill his family due to circumstances. One of his strongest desires is to become immortal in some way. While his BE! counterpart hasn't appeared here yet, let's just say that, well... pumping oneself full of Death-element in the belief that one's body can become immune to it is a VERY stupid idea. It destroyed his mind and body to the point where he's had to have cybernetics forcibly installed into his head just to hold his existence together, which is utter agony on the still-functional parts of his body. The device he carries on his back, which grants him his powers, was similarly affected, degrading to the point where nobody can repair the damage, limiting him to only a fraction of what his full power used to be. Yes, he's technically immortal because he can't die in his current state, but the cost was far too high, he's barely even recognizable as himself anymore... et cetera et cetera.
Black Ending Engie is a subject that I really don't want to get into. Let's just leave it that his personality is inspired by someone's alternative character interpretation of him being a dangerous and psychopathic megalomaniac.
GODDAMN IT
STUPID GENDERFLIP VIRUS
That is false I have seen that I can write stories without evil conflict or people doing mistakes or bad stuff happening or anything of this kind.
Going from the principle any of those is needed is just being restrained.
Revan already has their worst ending possible for them.
And Nyarly... Well, I doubt he can be given a bad ending... He's just too strong, he could be minorly inconvenienced for a 100 years or so...
He ate the bread that he made from stone
He fell from the Temple, never broke a bone
Bowed down to the Emperor and watched as former King was overthrown
He sits alone on his throne.
Wanna bet Revan?
Eldritch abominations are killable.
You can torture them.
You just have to be strong enough, and we've got characters capable of doing it.
As a side note on the rant about not being able to kill the Conflict, I mostly agree with Tazz and Twin, no disagreements important enough to deserve being mentioned, so yeah. No killing the Conflict. If such a thing happened, it would have to be in some sort of ultimate grand finale involving, I dunno, thousands of forum goers and like a hundred coordinated GMs.
Somehow, I don't see that happening any time soon.
Anyways tazz, yeah, it's sort of a 'distant thought' idea. My thought was to have it hosted on the DTG forums, since there's likely to be lots of non-canon (or potentially-canon. Call it schrodingers canon since most likely aspects from non-canon sessions will be brought in) sessions in the meantime to keep use occupied. Once the time comes for it, we'd start DTG3.
I dunno, it's a vague idea in my head right now, not one I want to implement for a while anyways.
DTG Co Labs
Nope, sorry guys, no Destroy the Godmodder relevant stuff here...
At least, not yet.
Well, Nyarlathotep is different case than most eldritch beings...
One, you'd have to kill off all of the Outer Gods to take him down, he'd merely regenerate. This includes Yog-Sothoth, The physical embodiment of Space and Time (Yog was the collection of spheres, sidenote: those spheres were every universe ever) And Azathoth, the Center of all universes. (Azy was the weird clam thing before he became the Center, now Azy is a bit... incomprehensible)
If you don't take them out before hunting down Nyarly, he'll just regenerate due to being their physical embodiment of their souls and consciousnesses. So... You'd gorilla over everything universe ever to even have a chance of killing him.
Second, you'd have to fight all of Nyarly's Masks in the Nothingness due to reality collapsing. All 1000 of them.
Hopefully the Narrative and the Conflict could piece reality back together after you defeated him.
So you are right Piono, you can kill Nyarlathotep, but is it worth it?
So kids what have we learned today?
Murder isn't always the best solution?
Good job. But did we really need to teach you that? I mean for humans that should just be common sense.
Also to fill image quota here is an artist's inaccurate depictions of my dear... "fathers" Azathoth and Yog-Sothoth... Heh.... Humans giving us false names... Always enjoyable.
Azy:
Yog:
He ate the bread that he made from stone
He fell from the Temple, never broke a bone
Bowed down to the Emperor and watched as former King was overthrown
He sits alone on his throne.
Fun fact, Lovecraftian horrors have a limited extent. Nyalathotep is unkillable without wrecking a certain GROUP of universes. Just like paradox space is its own universe cluster, the ones that the lovecraftian horrors originate from is its own cluster. It is possible to kill them.
It would wreck things on a scale greater than the first DTG (not the second one, that one was truly catastrophic), but it's still possible.
And I have the OP King, who, barring the OP scale, and also the fact that he doesn't exist right now, would be more than capable of wiping the entire thing off the face of reality. Permanently.
But if worst comes to worst, I also have Eternis, the god of infinity.
But this is a pointless fight.
Also, I decided, against my own better judgement, to, why not? join DTG0. I have way too much time on my hands anyways.
I'm going to go with a nondescript character, as this is just another thing of the OP King putting his two cents in because ego. I doubt I'll have a large effect, since I'm just going to be going with straight elementals, archons and titans.
EDiT:
O.O
That's a lot of stuff to take in all at once. I'm probably going to be useless for the first couple of rounds.
DTG Co Labs
Nope, sorry guys, no Destroy the Godmodder relevant stuff here...
At least, not yet.
Ah but you forget something, how big the influence of the Cthulhu Mythos has gotten along with its characters popping up in multiple realities (Stephen King's Universe for starters, Nyarlathotep is the main anagonist of Dark Tower), but once again pointless and besides the OP King could probably curb-stomp Nyarly.
But why would they bother with me, besides... I'd love to meet their creator as well as their newest comrade instead.
Speaking of Hypothetical Fights, a certain matter never got resolved satisfyingly
Alicia: 2 The Acolyte: 0
Place your bets, who shall win who shall lose!
It shall be fun, bloodshed a plenty!
He ate the bread that he made from stone
He fell from the Temple, never broke a bone
Bowed down to the Emperor and watched as former King was overthrown
He sits alone on his throne.
The OP King's creator? That could be one of two people: either the Author, who is stronger, or Eric, who is one of my weakest characters, being at an actually reasonable power level.
DTG Co Labs
Nope, sorry guys, no Destroy the Godmodder relevant stuff here...
At least, not yet.
Yes.
He ate the bread that he made from stone
He fell from the Temple, never broke a bone
Bowed down to the Emperor and watched as former King was overthrown
He sits alone on his throne.
I like how Tahm Kench somehow managed to bargain with himself
GODDAMN IT
STUPID GENDERFLIP VIRUS
It can happen, believe me. Personal experience.
He ate the bread that he made from stone
He fell from the Temple, never broke a bone
Bowed down to the Emperor and watched as former King was overthrown
He sits alone on his throne.
I have a feeling those two alone would be lethal.
Posts may contain high amounts of stupid.
. And you know what the best part of all this is? You'll DO it. And then you'll lose to me again. And again. And again!!! Because you want a "happy ending." Because you "love your friends." Because you "never give up." Isn't that delicious? Your "determination." The power that let you get this far... It's gonna be your downfall!